Honest Evaluation Of Quinn

Quinn has been a mixed bag so far showing some good things and some bad. This is how I would grade him:

Positives - He has remade our entire OL and we have a decent group up front right now. No OL is perfect, but overall this is a much better OL than we ever had under Mayhew or Millen. It takes a lot of resources to remake an OL and it will cause deficiencies elsewhere, which it has.

Negatives - he seems to have no idea how important speed is in the NFL and how much more important it is as we go. Tabor and Tavai are two examples of guys without the necessary speed to be effective players at the NFL level. LB as a whole is a complete bust for Quinn. Spielman needs to be hired to coach the LB’s (or defense as a whole) as he is not finding guys who understand the position and have the skills and makeup to succeed.

Draft - he added Ragnow, Swift, Hockenson, Golladay, Okwara, Oruwariye, Crosby, Dahl, Jackson & Okudah.

Negatives - Tabor, Davis, Tavai

FA - Marvin, Amendola, Collins, Flowers, Kearse, Shelton, Trufant, Coleman

Negatives - He has added mostly productive guys, but no home runs whatsoever.

Trades - Griffen, far too few trades when this is the cheapest way to add talent in the NFL!

He was a first time GM and has had a learning curve, but has he learned? Where is our speed at LB, WR or in the secondary? Not every “personnel guy” understands every position. Clearly LB is not one he understands or we would have TJ Watt instead of Davis. He made his mistake with Tabor and hopefully he has learned. The biggest question mark he has had was Patricia, who has shown some good things and lots of bad things. I was impressed how well they competed without Stafford last year and showed fight. On the bad side there are times when the team is clearly not prepared for the challenge.

Overall without this team growing through the rest of the season you have to give Patricia a fail and Quinn one for hiring him, despite what I like with the OL. The next 7 games we need to grow and win at least 5/7. The challenges of Covid and no camp have hurt a lot of teams so if it is close I suspect we see one more campaign, but winning 5 games will not be easy!

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Negatives on the FA side should definitely include Vaitai

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This is a tough question as folks will rightfully look at the record and the hiring of Patricia ad say fail. And they are not totally wrong.

I have been on the train that says the talent on this team is pretty good. The defensive scheme isn’t very good.

Perfection isn’t the standard. Quinn has managed the cap well although most agree that we want to extend Golladay.

Past that there is a mixed bag of hits and misses. I look at success later in the draft (3rd rd. and after) and Quinn has made some nice picks there including Glasgow, Golladay, CB AO, Agnew, Tracy Walker, Jonah Jackson and so on. Misses? Yep he has had misses. Jarrad Davis is mostly a miss. The second rd. has not been kind to Quinn.

Free agency has also had up and downs. Marvin Jones was excellent. Vaitai not so much so.

I think it starts and ends with the decision to fire Caldwell and hire Patricia that earns Quinn a failing grade. I agree and was (and am) fine with firing Caldwell. But hiring Patricia and watching this mess unfold has been disaster and Quinn has to own that.

Wins and losses are what matter most and Quinn fired a winning coach and brought in this disaster. I think that means he has earned a D grade. Failing. Not an E as he has moments but his grade has to be defined by his record and firing Caldwell and bringing in Patricia. Hard to see this any other way.

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It amazes me how how everyone admits how bad we are… then give optimistic grades on our players. Tracy walker, will harris, jahlani tavai and jarrad davis are all high draft picks that have been relegated to the bench. Jayron kearse was meant to be a special teamer… and he’s starting. Reggie ragland only starts on terrible defenses. We extended christian jones… Why? On offense we’ve used high picks on non impact players and are in a terrible spot with few playmakers going into next year. I’m finding positives to be pretty hard to find.

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Leadership skills: F
Draft: C-
FA: D
Coach selection: F
Cap mgmt: B

Seems like he would be a good addition to the finance team

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IMO? Quinn hasn’t done enough to earn the grades to stay here…

It’s hard to win when you draft role-players with your high round picks!

Agree. He simply doesn’t have ‘it’ when comes to making the final decision on high draft picks.
Maybe his staff sucks, but that’s still on him. Too many huge draft misses, non-impactful FA’s, and more importantly, too many losses.

Win/loss record gets him a D, and dropping. Needs to be removed with coach asap.

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Thanks for the detailed take. I’m going to disagree. I wasn’t against getting rid of Mayhew, he made a lot of mistakes. In my opinion he was way better than Quinn and it isn’t close.
a) Records: Mayhew took over 0-16 and made them into a playoff contender, while Quinn has taken a playoff contender and driven into irrelevance.
b) Mayhew chose Schwartz and then Caldwell as coaches. Since Caldwell is basically the best coach in modern Lions history (an admittedly low bar), and Patricia has been an unmitigated disaster, Mayhew wins this very important part of the equation outright.

c) Personnel: Just look at every position group on the team. An honest appraisal would be that Quinn has improved the offensive line. Also, take into account how much capital he has spent here. If the line failed then Quinn would already be gone. Think of all the potential money wasted on TJ Lang and Rick Wagner that could’ve been used elsewhere.But where else outright is this team better equipped? Not a single position on defense. And don’t grade on potential. The Lions history has been paved with the bones of potential.
QB? Stafford still, a Mayhew pick and Quinn has done little to procure any new talent or a future replacement here.
WR? Arguable. but I would easily take CJ, Burleson and Tate over Jones, Golliday, Amendola as a group.
RB? RB was always crap, but its been no better under Quinn. Swift shows potential but so dis KJ two years ago and now he’s a glorified blocker. You can’t argue that the RB room is better now than it was. Currently the Lions have the vaunted 25th best running game in the league. I’d call this a wash, although at least Bell Riddick and bush had a decent year or two.
TE: Hockenson was drafted about the same place as Ebron and Pettigrew, and you can talk potential all you like but he so far hasn’t proven anything. He’s had a decent year so far I guess, he’s the eighth best TE in the league this year so yay I guess, but he isn’t any more dominant than Ebron or Pettigrew were so far. I can be charitable here and call it a wash.
Special teams, I mean maybe you can give the edge to Quinn, but god dammit this team is basically all special teamers, which brings me to my next point.
Star and pro bowl level players: Mayhews tenure: Calvin, Avril, Suh, Stafford, Levy, Slay, Quinn, Prater, Tate, Ziggy.
Star and Pro bowl players under Quinn: Stafford, Prater, Ragnow, and Golliday.

To me I can’t understand how anyone can defend the guy but I guess it’s personal opinion. He hates high end talent, loves trading and taking cast offs from the patriots 36 times a year trying to outthink the greatest football mind in history, and he fired a middling football coach for an absolutely terrible one. He has weakened the team at most position groups and it’s an embarrassment. I’m not trying to put Mayhew on some pedestal, and I don’t want him back, but to me there isn’t much daylight between Quinn and Millen. There, I said it.

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Quinn has drafted a grand total of two difference-makers in five years.

Kenny G. and Ragnow.

Two.

In five years.

The rest have ranged from Good, to OK, to a little below average, to disasters.

Sorry, you can’t go through five first- and second-round picks and only get two difference-makers.

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Ooooof… this is some painful truth right here. I think if he had kept Caldwell and built the oline/rushing attack he was able to do with guys like Decker/Dahl/Ragnow/Jackson/Crosby/Swift we may have built something good here…

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Mayhew also got our last 1000yd rusher. Reggie Bush. Bush and Joique Bell had at least 500yds rushing and receiving, on the same team.

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Its not easy getting playmakers drafting as late as we do.

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I’m more on the fence about Quinn as opposed to Patricia.

Quinn undoubtedly deserves blame for the MP hire. And while he’s been WAY too conservative in the draft (until this last year) and generally uninspiring I think when it’s all said and done this will be an excellent rookie class. Hit on Julian and have El Jefe come along and it can be a once a decade or two type of class. If he drafts more like ‘19 going forward our talent will trend in the right direction.

No difference makers in FA.

Lang, Wagner, Peterson, Amendola, Trufant, Vaitai, Williams, Shelton, Harmon, Cornwall, Spence, Worrilow, Blounte, Jesse frickin James Flowers, Ragland, Collins, Coleman etc…and the closest he has come, Marvin Jones.

Thats a lot of money…A LOT of money for average starters.

Really, this is criminally bad and is enough to fire him without going into his terrible scouting wye in the draft and lack of understanding g of game speed and draft slot value.

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1st round pick Decker. Franchise LT with a 16OA pick. This was a nailed pick. Many GM’s do not nail their franchise LT pick. I’ll be critical of BQ when he deserves it, and I do believe we need a new direction, but this for me is heavily weighted with the failure of MP. I will not get with ONLY Kenny and Ragnow as “difference makers.” Your franchise LT who routinely shuts down the best pass rushers the NFL has to offer is indeed a “difference maker.”

1st round pick Hockenson. I would not have made the pick then, and if I could go back in time, I still wouldn’t have made the pick. But that’s because I had a TD for Burns and he’s turned out to be a franchise pass rusher. BUT he’s on track for over 660 yards this season and has 5TD’s in 9 games. He’s become a go to guy for Stafford when we need a first down. He has 23 of those so far this year. He’s not Kelce/Kittle yet and maybe never will hit that ceiling. But he is better than a “good” TE.

2nd round pick Swift. BQ has not chosen to give 900 year old AP a ton of snaps that SHOULD have gone to Swift. That is on MP/Bevell. But I think it is safe to put him in the “difference maker” category. He has shown everything you want already. Speed, patience, elusiveness, and the ability to put guys on their asses at the end of a run. Yes he has had some drops. One that has us 4-5 right now instead of 5-5 like we should be. But he also has great ability as a receiver. You don’t call DeAndre Swift “good.” He is a “difference maker.” He just needs to be allowed to be the man and it appears the staff has finally pulled their heads from their asses on the guy.

3rd round pick Glasgow. Chose not to pay him the 4 year 44M contract Denver did, but those type of deals don’t go to “good” OGs.

3rd round pick Jackson. Glasgow’s replacement has started every game as a rookie and to my eyes is a better player.

5th round pick Jamal Agnew has made a Pro Bowl and has 4 TDs on returns.

UDFA Jack Fox is the best Punter in the NFL and will most certainly make the Pro Bowl. Being the best player in the NFL at your position makes you a difference maker.

Again, I want Quintricia gone. So I don’t have an agenda here. Just calling balls and strikes. There have been plenty of misses. But there have been some home runs too. More than just two, sorry.

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Isn’t that part of the lions culture

Managed by a finance team ?
In a portfolio …

I feel a little guilty for agreeing with this take

But I’m also a little bitter Thst the roster churn I often thought of a creating competition and good for roster
Yet it
Feels like moving deck chairs and pissing people off because they never got a fair chance
And hurts the team.

When you see that money they spent
Snd thst they were bitter enough with Calvin to try and recoup a million

Are some fans watching how the team has spent that millions ? Lang waited to get cut before retiring so lions couldn’t come fir his signing bonus.

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I disagree that Decker is a “difference maker.” I would put him in the “Good” category. He had regressed and it’s nice to see him bounce back this year.

As for Hockenson and Swift, can’t call either difference-makers yet.

A team that I think does drafting as good as anybody is the Steelers. I look at their (undefeated) team and there’s quality depth EVERYWHERE. They obviously know what they are doing putting together rosters.

Thinking about Bob Quinn’s first and second rounds, I decided to check out the Steelers’ the last five years. The disparity is startling.

2020
1st - Traded to MIA for CB Minkah Fitzpatrick. I’d say that’s working out OK.
2nd - Chase Claypool, WR - Already on his way to stardom.

2019
1st - Devin Bush LB. Pro Bowl Alternate his rookie year
2nd - Diontae Johnson WR. Starter, regular contributor to great offense.

2018
1st Terrell Edmunds, S - 16-game starter each of the past two seasons, 105 tackles last year.
2nd James Washington WR - They like their WRs in Pittsburgh, and here’s another contributor in the rotation.

2017
1st T.J. Watt OLB - Elite
2nd JuJu Smith-Schuster WR - Elite

2016
1st Artie Burns, CB - was a regular every-game starter for the three or so seasons he was there, but nothing special.
2nd Sean Davis, FS - Played in all 16 games as a rookie, and was an every-game starter the following two seasons.

No Teez Tabors here. No weird reaches. The worst they do is a player who plays and contributes every game. The best they do are some of the best players at their position in the game.

Want to go raid somebody’s front office for the next regime? Stay the hell away from New England, and try Pittsburgh.

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