Dahl-Ragnow-Thuney as the interior is A territory, IMO. We may drop into B territory when factoring in the OTs.
Decker and Wagner are good enough to not drag the line down. Wagner is just shy of being in the top half at his position. An injury or having to overcome subpar play next to him and his shortcomings become quickly apparent. He is not agile. But he is powerful and a good run blocker. And, Decker is solid, top third of left tackles and our best run blocker, a blind side protector at least proficient enough for a competent QB to get rid of the ball. Thuney would lock this unit down regardless of the last piece being Benzschawel or whomever.
The Lions cannot overcompensate at this position if the play is average. Glasgow is average. You have to have average players. The proper way to run an organization is to know the players are average and pay them that way, not overpay because average joe is as replaceable as your average fast food worker. I like Glasgow. The GM does, too. It’s his job to be able to field an average player for an average salary. This is a necessary business action. So lets say Quinn put 5.35 million on the table and Graham thinks he can do better. This situation happens. Now, Quinn gets to make an offer on his replacement and he gets to decide if he will pay a premium for a player he considers to be an upgrade(Thuney). Team building 101.
Air…if the Lions need game film for Glasgow and Wiggins in games in 2019 they need to be fired now. Wiggins was in Detroit in 2018 too. In fact, Kenny started 10 games for the Lions in 2018.
If the decision to rotate Graham and Wiggins was based in injury concerns I get that. But that would be weird. The most likely situation (and easiest to understand) is that Graham and Wiggins as roughly the same and neither guy clearly beat out the other in open competition thus the rotation. A rotation on the OL is weird.
If the Lions want Wiggins back we can have him for cheap. If the Lions don’t see Graham as a clear upgrade from Wiggins there is no way Graham will be back here if that is what Detroitn sees. And if that is the case yea, Thuney might be seen as a far better option for the Lions than Graham.
One last thought…Detroit might have liked Graham Glasgow as a center prospect but as of 2019 Ragnow is the starting level center here and Frank is a great center. Graham was a center placeholder for Frank in 2018. It is possible the Lions just don’t like Graham much as a guard? That would explain the rotation in 2019.
I think you forget Aboushi was part of that rotation too. GG clearly outplayed the other two OG’s by the way. All 3 are free agents this year too.
Keep in mind there’s a huge difference between seeing an OG in practice (no contact) as opposed to on game day (full contact) Thanks to the NFLPA and the teams inability to have full contact practices sometimes the only way to truly judge an OG is on game day. So the Lions ran an OG rotation to get a strong feel for just what they really have. It really is that simple.
I think BQ is planning to overhaul the interior OL but before he does he really needed a strong evaluation of what he had.
Thanks for the reply Air. I like this conversation.
The Lions have two solid players in Ragnow at center and now Dahl at LOG. Dahl was already extended. The only question seems to be how good is Graham. PFF notes the Lions have the 21th best OL in the league:
" 11. DETROIT LIONS
At this point last season, we were discussing how Frank Ragnow was all over the map after his rookie season at guard. Following his switch to center prior to this season, Ragnow finished 2019 as the sixth-highest graded player at the position in a much-improved sophomore campaign. Ragnow increased both his pass-blocking grade and run-blocking grade nearly 15 points from his rookie season. Taylor Decker and Graham Glasgow also enjoyed top-10 finishes at their respective positions in overall PFF grade."
I am on board with re-signing Graham. In my opinion Graham has been solid in starting three pposituons with the Lions (LOG, center and ROG). But I also get it that the Lions might be having trouble assessing Graham’s value.
The rotation at ROG never, ever made sense to me. It didn’t at the time and it makes less sense now. Pick a winner and roll with that guy period.
Either the Lions were playing it cute with a rotation at ROG OR the Lions don’t see Graham as that much better than Wiggins. Aboushi was also in that mix but Wiggins and Graham were the top two guys.
I don’t know what the Lions are thinking at ROG but it appears to me the LOG and center questions are answered. Dahl is locked down through 2021 now and Joe turns 27 in April.
I bring back Graham if possible. I am also cool signing a free agent like Thuney. I am less happy about rolling with an unproven rookie and having another hole to fill UNLESS that cap $ was necessary to field a great defense in which case I get that decision.
When I look at the OL play. Then I look at the lack of holes for our run game. I think the Lions need to get better. Then I look at the cost we have placed on our OL and compare it to the rest of the league … I realize we have money to burn there. So that begs the question … why let GG walk then? For me that answer is simple. We think we can do better and we will approach FA on a mission to do so.
I guess we will know soon enough … but that’s where I’m leaning.
I was just gonna share this tweet … lol
Looks like Lang agrees with me. He even says in the comments that Thuney is top 5 at his position.
I was just about to share that part, too.
The moral here is that he sees the value in moving on and moving up. Glasgow has earned a lot of our respect and he deserves it, but there’s room to move here and TJ agrees.
Great minds think alike!
I dont know but the more I think about the Lions targeting Thuney the more it makes sense. I hope I’m right.
So do I. I’ve advocated moving on from Glasgow and taken a bit of heat for it. It’s obviously going to be in FA because there’s nobody on the roster waiting to take the spot, unlike last year when Dahl finally had enough development to step into a starter’s role.
Agreed - I figure either we.
A) Target a free agent upgrade
B) Sign a veteran stop gap and draft an OG in round 2.
I think the Lions are just being coy about GG. You can’t expect BQ to tip his hand or to say that he wants to upgrade from GG.
I’m expecting us to be buyers at OG.
Yea, I think as each day passes that it is unlikely Graham will be back and that Bob likes Thuney a lot.
I assume Jones is the dt from KC?
Chad, these guys are running things their way. If Graham comes back and says 5M is what Cleveland offered and the powers that be say they can live with that, he’ll be back, but if they have him pegged at 4 million, he’s gone.
Yes he was referring to Chris Jones. It’s looking more and more like he could be a free agent too.
Looks like the Lions are going to have some competition for Thuney…
Yeah not surprised about Thuney but McCourty? Why would Miami want a 32 year old veteran S? That doesn’t make sense to me.
The way I see it, we could invest in both Thuney and Conklin if we dump Wagner, let GG move on, and still not be too handicapped to sign other FA’s.
I think Wagner is getting elite level pay for below average performance. You should be able to get above average play for top 20 pay. Or elite performance for elite level pay. We are not getting remotely close to that with Wagner, yet are paying him to be. Time to cut bait instead of continuing to accept crap play while being one of our most costly cap hits.
You’re right. Return on investment from Wagner is sub par. He is a mid level player on a good day. What he is making is better than that, so, he needs replacing but not direly so. Next year.