Objective Expectations for 2020

I think even those of us who would prefer to see Patricia fired at the end of this season have come to expect that he will be back for 2020.

So if he is retained, what are the proper expectations for the results of the 2020 season for him to be able to keep the job for 2021?

To me, it has to be a substantial step forward from where we ended 2017. That means 10+ wins and making some noise in the playoffs. Just getting back to where we were a couple of years ago seems insufficient to me after enduring the last couple of years.

What say you?

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If he coaches again in 2020, I expect to suck. He’s given us 2 years of suck, so why would we expect anything else? And as we’ve talked about before, when a coach gives you 2 years of suck, its rare for him to give you a 3rd year of non-suck.

I am rarely an “all in” kind of a guy when it comes to what “needs” to happen with a team. I get that 9-7 is a tough record to get to in the NFL, even without a playoff appearance. But I can’t “settle” for anything less than a playoff victory…period. As rare as it is for a coach who’s sucked for 2 years to suddenly not suck in year 3, its pretty much non-existent in the salary cap era for a coach who didn’t win by 3 years to suddenly become a winner in year 4.

So in summary, if we fire Patricia and move on…I’m okay with the next coach giving us an improvement, even if it doesn’t come with a winning record or playoff victory. But if its Patricia, its all or nothing. Playoff win or hit the unemployment line. If Quinn fires Patricia this year, I give him a few more years to ride it out with the next coach. If Quinn retains Patricia, I tie their fates together. Playoff win or hit the unemployment line.


The “Patriot Way” would be to fire Patricia and Quinn. It is my hope that we never hear that term again as there is nothing that they have done that in any way resembles what that actually means. I also assume that those two will be back and it is actually scary to see what FA and the draft brings because they are floundering in their current philosophies on D and to a lesser degree on O.

I believe it will be their mission to hang this on injuries because it is the only thing that they can point to that is credible with re to their performance. They also are going to have to fire some lesser members of the staff just to show that going forward that they are “serious”. It’s a tried and proven path but it is still a “What have you done lately” league and this only buys time for one more season. I wasn’t totally against getting rid of JC because I really did think he had hit his ceiling but I was also aware of what had recently happened to the Bears when they fired Lovie Smith in a 10 win season.

Floundering staff and ownership just keeps turning the knife that the Lions have put in the gut of their fans. I understand why fans keep supporting them it’s just sad that there has been nothing that this organization has done in my lifetime to earn that kind of loyalty. My expectations are that I seriously doubt that this particular nucleus of staff won’t be able to get 8 wins next year and will be gone. I would rather see sooner than later, but I doubt that that will be the case.


I think even with a good offseason Quinntricia gets this team to no better than 8-8 next year, which is still garbage.

My desires are to have a new GM and a new coach in place by the end of January.

My expectations is that nothing changes and we get fed more of the same shitburgers next year.

In 4 years, a GM can overhaul most of the team’s roster, and Bob Quinn has done just that. The problem is, we now have less talent than we had when Quinn arrived. Plain and simple.

Our best players are:
Stafford (who Quinn inherited) coming off 2 years of back injuries.

Kenny G. - Who is Quinn’s only great draft pick out of 34 selections. Who will likely be looking to bend Quinn over to become the highest paid WR in NFL history (see the contract BQ gave Stafford).

Slay - (Who Quinn inherited) who will in my opinion not play another down here after this season.

That’s it. The other 50 guys on the roster are nothing more than mediocre, average, bad, injury prone, or just unknown at this point. There are a ton of guys who are getting severely overpaid (bad signings), and after Kenny G gets his new deal, there will hardly be any players on the entire team that are playing at a bargain price. That is a recipe for disaster and more evidence that Quinn is the wrong guy.

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Requirement to keep job: win the division or a playoff game.

My expectations for 2020: a healthier roster and likely 6 or 7 wins, then fired.

Quinn screws up the 1st round pick and goes OL or DB, a pick that takes a couple of years to develop


Good wording choice, @Luk09.

What I was going for in the OP was the requirement idea more so than predictions.

Nothing less then a playoff win. If not time to bring out an XL broom.

4-12 will be an improvement.

Sell it, brother! You know that will be the talking points next year. Maybe not 4-12, but 7-9 gets Quinn year 6 and 'Tricia year 4 for sure. It’s the way it goes here. Zero expectations, zero results, plenty of handouts.

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Part of me feels like Lions fans deserve this. The other part feels like nobody could ever deserve this.


No way do the fans deserve this. Its just magnified because ALL the other pro teams here suck just as bad.

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If you want to state your objective expectations, start by building your depth chart.
Who do you want back in starter roles?
With those returning starters, who do expect improvement from or to maintain their level of play?

Now, where you have your holes, how are you going to fill them? You get 2 starters from the 2020 draft class. Are you able to fill the remainder of your roster in free agency?

Trust your grade at the end of the season.

I will assign expectations for Patricia when I see the production from the GM this off-season. Demanding anything right now is just blowing hot air.


Here is a twist on an old saying, but, one that is just common sense. “You get what you pay for.”
Lions fans have been paying for this shit for 60 years!

Some fans deserve it, because they make excuses for this disaster. I feel bad for the ones that showed up with “sell the team” gear. Those fans must honestly want to effect change. Problem is, the ownership doesn’t care about the fans. Never has.


Has the roster gotten worse since Patricia came on board?

More importantly, has the roster gotten worse in any way that wasn’t under Patricia’s direction, i.e. decisions made to fit “his scheme” on defense?

I’ve got no issue if someone says the overall talent level could be improved. But roster isn’t an excuse. Caldwell showed that this caliber of roster was able to go to the playoffs. This is a coaching / scheme issue first and foremost.


that is why their jobs are on the damn line-Quinn & Patricia. The product the set of the field in 2020 saves them or sinks them . Quinn has some heavy lifting to do and we wait to see if he’s “good enough” to do that.

It’s the people that hire and fire the teams brass. 60 years and they still can’t get it right.
This dumpster fire has a blue oval with FORD written on it.
Take no more excuses!

I have zero concern for what was. (not to sound like a jerk)
It has no bearing on now or next year. I don’t care about last year. I don’t care what Quinn said. I am not talking about ambiguous “better” or “worse” statements. I drill down and define who belongs as a starter and who belongs as depth, identifying the holes.

I will tell you that to begin the 2019 season at the cut to 53, it was easy. WAYYYYY too easy. In fact, I mentioned that I could cut the roster to 46 players and the names I threw out doing it wouldn’t raise an eyebrow. So, to be honest, the “depth” of the team is more myth than it is reality. We have more depth players in starting roles, but not more depth.

I’m not into excuse-making. I’m also not into arbitrary expectations.

Who fits as starters against refined talent in a league filled with elite athletes? That’s what matters. 1951 doesn’t, Patricia’s waistband doesn’t. Horses matter. We’re down a few and it will take quality personnel decisions to set this thing on a course for success.


That’s fine, and if your contention is that the team needs to be more talented to make any real noise, you’re not going to get an argument from me.

However, comparing the talent level on this team to ones from 3 and 4 years ago is helpful in evaluating Patricia’s ability to coach and scheme. I think you’d be hard pressed to say that the 2018 and 2019 Lions have measurably less talent than the 2016 and 2017 Lions, yet the results are hugely worse. That points to coaching.

If Patricia can only get 6 wins out of a 9 win roster, why is there any hope that he can do anything meaningful even if more talent is added?


Right. We need a guy like Daniel Snyder who will get involved with the day-to-day operations to really turn this thing around.