Guy has it. No argument. He is worth the #3.
There is no doubt the kid is a skilled athlete but keep in mind the QBs he faced this season.
Peyton Ramsey (Indiana 19 of 33 - 5 sacks), Adrian Martinez (Nebraska 8 of 17 - 4 sacks), Brian Lewerke (MSU 20 of 38 - 4 sacks), Aidan Smith (northwestern 6 of 20 -1 sack), Jack Coan (Wisconsin 10 of 17 5 sacks), Josh Jackson and T Pigrome (Maryland 8 of 17 - 7 sacks), Johnny Langan (Rutgers 12 of 26 - 1 sack), Sean Clifford and Will Levis (Penn State 16 of 28- 5 sacks), Shea Patterson (UofM 18 of 43 - 2 sacks). Playoff Vs Wisconsin Coan (17 of 33 - 2 sacks)
Their non conference schedule wasn’t loaded either. Chris Robison (Fla Atlantic 22 of 34 - 4 sacks), Desmond Ridder (Cincinnati 13 of 20 4 sacks ), Brett Gabbert (Miami OH 5 of 15 - 5 sacks)
BOWL GAME Clemson T Lawrence 18 of 33 with 3 sacks. Okudah had 5 tackles so that is good and 2 pass break-ups.
So he played well on a team that put pressure on the opposing QBs. NONE of those QBs were anything special except maybe Lawrence and he was 50% in the bowl game so he was either under pressure or not on his game.
I am not saying he isn’t any good as he covered some decent receivers in the Big Ten but things will change at the next level in terms of the receivers and the QBs that are throwing to them. This is why I’d would go Brown if we don’t get Young and since we are potentially losing 3 DTs at this point. FA could change things too!
Very good points, for me Okudah as the pick depends on several factors like do we keep Slay or is there a trade down scenario. I’m on the fence but given no moves right now I would take him but could be moved to Brown.
To me the ideal would be Young or trade-down and grab bpa (prefer defense).
That said, I like Okudah and won’t feel bad if we grab him at 3. I just think that we can get him with a limited trade-down and we would lose value staying put and taking him. I would be ok taking a dlineman and picks over Okudah at 3 as well because I believe it would be better value.
I really like Okudah so I won’t be disappointed with the pick. But… Few CB’s are worthy of a top 3 pick to be honest. Mainly because they take a few years to adjust to the NFL. However I do believe he’s better than Ward who went #4.
If we stay at 3 the pick should be Brown in my opinion. (assuming Young goes #2) Brown will have a bigger immediate impact. DT’s are far more likely to get a second contract as well. Personally I think Brown is a safer pick too.
But if we trade down and get Okudah than I’d be good with it.
He was fantastic against Clemson. The passing game was shut down largely because of him, he really stood out to me more than Young actually but there is some merit to the fact that he lined up against a lot of mediocre passing attacks.
What it boils down to is positional importance since there are so many needs on the defensive side. If all players reach their potential, do you prefer an elite DT (Brown), an elite shutdown corner (Okudah) or an elite LB/S hybrid (Simmons). For me, DT holds the most value but IMO, Okudah is a safer bet to reach his upside than Brown and Simmons being a bit of a tweener is a bit concerning.
Either way, I hope they are getting one of these guys at 5 or 6. I expect no trade down but in the same token, I’d be upset if Quinn didn’t take advantage of the combination of this being a rich QB class and QB hungry teams below them.
I’m not sure I agree that DTs are quicker to adjust to the league than corners nowadays, but either way, give me the player who’s gonna have the best career, not the most immediate impact.
Completely agree with this. Hope you are wrong about the Trade down
That is really difficult to determine.
That’s why I don’t really agree with posters referring to prospects as “elite,” before they’ve ever set foot on an NFL field. Some of these guys are going to bust out, it happens every year.
Oh I agree 100%. I can’t say which of Brown or Okudah or Young will have the better career (though it wouldn’t surprise me if they were all great). All I meant was don’t let immediate impact keep you from drafting a better player.
Me too but the reality is that these trades are hard to execute and Quinn has never shown the ability to be a creative trader.
It’s really a perfect storm though for at least one of the Redskins or Lions to trade down. Either one would benefit the Lions greatly.
Being in the big ten you don’t get to face too many top QB’s but that hasn’t stopped OSU from producing quality DB’s. Ward, Hooker and Lattimore being recent success stories. Personally I think he’s better than these guys were.
I’d judge him more by the WR’s he’s faced. He hasn’t faced a ton of top end WR’s so that is a concern but what top WR’s he did face… here is how he did.
Tee Higgins 4-33
Q. Cephus 7-122
Q. Cephus 3-57 he faced him twice.
KJ. Hamler 3-45
He didn’t give up a TD to any of them.
Rookie DT (ones drafted high) tend to have a bigger rookie impact than rookie CB’s do. Most rookie CB’s (even ones drafted high) tend to be a liability.
That’s a huge unknown that even the best GM’s struggle with predicting. But for me I look at how many top drafted CB’s vs DT’s didn’t get a second contract from their drafting team. Which suggests that DT could be the better long term investment.
I like both and I suspect that the Lions have them both rated very high. But if I were a betting man … I’d say that BQ would take the safer pick of the two.
Cephus had his best games vs the best competition, wasn’t just Ohio St but the dude just ran a 4.73 at the combine. He had 5 receptions for 114 and a TD vs Minny and 7 for 59 and a TD vs Oregon.
I saw that. I have to wonder if that effects his draft much. He was never expected to be fast but I was expecting the 4.57- 4.6 range. He’s a physical WR with great hands. That slow speed probably means he will project too the slot in the NFL.
He could be a late round steal.
He might not get drafted because of the rape charge even though he was acquitted. Actually the slot would be best because he is slow off the start and almost needs to be in motion to be effective.
Nevermind the title, just listen to the dude.
He is to Matt Patricia what Best was to Schwartz, guaranteed.
Ramsey, Lattimore, Ward, Tre White, Jaire Alexander all hit the ground running. Marlon Humphrey was brought along slowly but he was good too when he got an opportunity. Really, you have to go back to 2016 to find CBs who were drafted in the top 20 and busted (Eli Apple, Vernon Hargreaves, and it turns out they were just bad players overall). I suppose you could argue Adoree Jackson has only been above average, but he’s a plus in the return game.
I just don’t buy this narrative that CBs can’t have an immediate impact, not with all the passes they have to defend at the college level nowadays. There’s not nearly as much they haven’t seen as there used to be.
While you might be right, everything that I have heard or read from NFL personnel is that it takes a CB at least 3 years before they get up to speed with the NFL. It has little to nothing to do with the passes and more to do with the WRs. NFL WRs are generally bigger and faster on a game to game basis vs college where a CB might see 1 or 2 big fast guys in a season.